FREE! Click here to Join FunTrivia. Thousands of games, quizzes, and lots more!
Fun Trivia
Home: Questions and Answers Forum
Answers to 100,000 Fascinating Questions
Welcome to FunTrivia's Question & Answer forum!

Search All Questions


Please cite any factual claims with citation links or references from authoritative sources. Editors continuously recheck submissions and claims.

Archived Questions

Goto Qn #


What is the significance of so many Jewish surnames ending in 'berg' (as mine did), as few English names relate to mountains or hills in comparison?

Question #96075. Asked by satguru.
Last updated Aug 21 2016.

Related Trivia Topics: Religion   English  
author
Answer has 3 votes
author
23 year member
2834 replies

Answer has 3 votes.
A lot of the surnames that sound Jewish to Americans are simply German names such as Klein, Gross or Grossman, Weiss or Weisman, Rosen, Schwartz or Schwartzman, Segal, Siegal or Sagal, and anything that contains berg, stein, man, thal or bluth. German surnames are very common among American Jews, and many people seem to have inferred the converse: if most Jews have German surnames, then most people with German surnames must be Jews. The reasoning is appealing on a gut-level but logically flawed. Consider this absurd but logically identical argument: most Jews have ten fingers, therefore most people with ten fingers must be Jews.

One reason for the frequency of German names among Jews is related to a misunderstanding of a 1787 Austro-Hungarian law. The Austro-Hungarian Empire, which controlled a substantial part of Europe, was the first country in Europe that required Jews to register a permanent family surname. At the same time, they required Jews to register a German given name. The decree was widely misinterpreted as requiring a German surname, so the overwhelming majority of Jewish surnames created for that registration were German ones. This explains the frequency of German surnames in Western Europe, but it doesn't explain the frequency of German surnames for Jews in the Russian Empire, where German surnames for Jews are also common. The frequency of German family names among Russia may be due to migration from Western Europe.

link http://www.jewfaq.org/jnames.htm

May 26 2008, 9:23 PM
queproblema
Answer has 4 votes
queproblema
19 year member
2119 replies

Answer has 4 votes.
I think many English surnames do relate to mountains or hills.

"Mount," "Hill," and "Hills" are all surnames, along with "Underhill," the redoubtable "Churchill," "Tuthill," and I believe "Tuttle," for a few.

Then there are the ones that end in "-ridge", like "Aldridge" and "Breckinridge."

The "duns" and some "dens" come from the Saxon for "hill":
Dunstan, Dunlevy, Landon, Chittenden, etc.

Perhaps stretching it a bit, there's "Claremont" from the French and of course "Mountbatten," straight from the German "Battenberg."

link http://www.thinkbabynames.com/meaning/1/Churchill
link https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mountbatten

Response last updated by Terry on Aug 21 2016.
May 26 2008, 10:38 PM
avatar
satguru star
Answer has 3 votes
satguru star
Moderator
21 year member
1250 replies avatar

Answer has 3 votes.
Thanks author, I know the geographical and linguistic origins generally, and think much of Eastern Europe was under German rule at the time when names were imposed, the good ones had to be paid for and the rest were given by the government officials. So as they actually chose many of them there does seem a very uneven preponderence of Bergs, even after you eliminate the existing German ones.

It's interesting QP about so many other names that have less obvious hill references so as ours are either berg or stein (which could mean the same thing) they are easier to spot. I've always been fascinated by names and you've taught me a lot more I didn't know about there.
I suppose the inevitable addition of gold (in my own case) or silver was just a case of wishful thinking.

May 27 2008, 8:37 AM
avatar
knud77 star
Answer has 6 votes
Currently Best Answer
knud77 star
21 year member
94 replies avatar

Answer has 6 votes.

Currently voted the best answer.
Maybe a bit off topic but why do Jewish/German surnames (-Man) end in only one 'n" but German names end (-Mann) in two "n's"?

May 27 2008, 10:49 AM
author
Answer has 4 votes
author
23 year member
2834 replies

Answer has 4 votes.
Maybe the latter question should be an entry of its own, but as it says in this German site, as a main rule the names would end with -man in Poland, in Israel and English speaking countries, and with -mann in German speaking countries.

link http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/J%C3%BCdische_Familiennamen#Ortsnamen

If I may return to the original question: My guess is that the -berg names are caused by a mixture of things. There are (or were) actually towns called Rosenberg, Goldberg, Grünberg etc., and the Jews may be named for their home town. But there is another, and perhaps more interesting explanation: These names may have seemed "well-sounding" (that is: "German" sounding, "normal") and attractive for the Jews who had the chance to select their own name. See for example this quote:

German-speaking Jews did not adopt family names until the 18th and 19th centuries. Some were allowed to choose their names, often creating two-part names containing well-sounding words. Examples: Goldblum (gold flower), Rosenthal (rose valley), Rothschild (red shield), Schwarzschild (black shield), Silberschatz (silver treasure), Stein (stone). Others had names assigned to them at the discretion of the administration, which picked, in some cases, even derogatory names. Yet others adopted traditional German names in order to blend in, most famously Meyer or Loewe, which could refer to the German 'Löwe' (Lion) as well as to the Jewish tribe of Levi.

link https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_family_name_etymology

May 27 2008, 11:41 AM
author
Answer has 4 votes
author
23 year member
2834 replies

Answer has 4 votes.
It seems, though, that most Jewish names (inside Austria-Hungary at least) were arbitrarily given. See this quote:

In some countries, such as the Austro-Hungarian Empire, Jews were forced to take surnames with a German appearance, and they usually could not choose them. These arbitrary family names have no relationship whatsoever with either the trade or craft, nor the physical description, nor the geographic origin of the person so named. We have already quoted SCHWARZ, WEISS, GROSS, KLEIN, and ROTH. But there are also a long series of names formed with two German roots such as MORGENSTERN, MORGENSTEIN, APFELBAUM, BIRNBAUM, ROSENBERG, ROSENBLUM, ROSENBAUM, WEINBAUM, WEINBERG..... Note that the spelling of these names varies considerably, especially when they transited through Poland or Russia.

[from an old article on genealoj.org]

It seems like also Napoleon had opinions on Jewish names.

Quote:
When the French emperor Napoleon Bonaparte overran all of Europe including Germany and Poland, he decreed that all Jews must adopt modern European names as first demanded by the French revolutionary (1789) government. Thereupon the Jews of Europe adopted many geographical names such as Rosenberg or mountain of roses, Goldberg or Silverberg or Lilienthal or valley of the lilies. If a Jew did not adopt such a name, then the state chose a name for him. This led to such names as Goldstein and Rubenstein and Silverstein, all connoting precious stones which, according to anti-Jewish sentiment, were all hidden in every Jewish home because “the Jews had all the money” (If we Jews had all the money, everybody would convert to Judaism this day).

link http://www.jbuff.com/c120502.htm

Response last updated by Terry on Aug 21 2016.
May 27 2008, 11:49 AM
author
Answer has 3 votes
author
23 year member
2834 replies

Answer has 3 votes.
Finally, here is an explanation of the specific name Grünberg/Grunberg/Greenberg.

Quote:
The family name GREENBERG is a partly translation of the original German form GRUNBERG, meaning 'green mountain'. This means that the first bearer of the surname GRUNBERG must have come from the locality called also GRUNBERG. When the bearer of the surname GRUNBERG moved to the Polish territory his surname could have changed a little, namely to that of GRUNBERG, as in Polish there is no such a phone and letter as German u. There is a town of Greenberg in Hesse, Germany, and a Greenberg in Silesia. This latter town was formerly an important center of wool weaving. Polish and Russian wool would be imported and material known as "grunberg" cloth would be exported. Many Jews were in this business and were known as " grunberg merchants", When they had to take permanent family names, many of these businessmen called themselves GREENBERG. An anglicized form of GRUENBERG ( also spelled GRU'NBERG with the u-umlant), literally "green mountain". The fact that it's German doesn't contradict Polish origin, however, much of what is now western Poland was ruled by Germans for many years, and a great many ethnic Germans lived there. Also interesting is that GRUENBERG was the German for the city of ZIELONA GORA ( which means "green mountain" in Polish) a provincial capital in western Poland.

link http://todmar.net/ancestry/greenberg_main.htm

May 27 2008, 12:02 PM
Arpeggionist star
Answer has 2 votes
Arpeggionist star
21 year member
2173 replies

Answer has 2 votes.
"Berg" can also mean "rock" or "town", and the suffix "-ton" often does end surnames as well as places in the English speaking world (Caxton, Hammilton, Scranton etc.). In German names as in English ones, the surname would refer to location where the family originates from, or to a known family line. In the Austro-Hungarian Empire in 1787, names of precious stones and metals were not forced on the Jewish public, but rather sold for higher prices than location names or occupational names (thus names "Ehrenkranz" or "Goldblum" would be more pricey and a higher status symbol than "Zimmermann" or "Grünberg").

Upon immigration to the US, often people with German surnames simply transliterated or half-translated their names, from say Grünburg to Greenberg, Lilienfeld to Lilienfield, and so forth.

May 27 2008, 2:24 PM
avatar
satguru star
Answer has 2 votes
satguru star
Moderator
21 year member
1250 replies avatar

Answer has 2 votes.
Well I'm fascinated, having grown up with such names around me all my life this could all be copied into the forums as a work in itself ('why is the sky blue' that is).

As far as I know (no German dictionary here) burg is town, like borough. I'd also be surprised if many people were named after small places where only a small number lived. And large towns do have many names referring to residents, Pinsky (Pinsk), Minsky (Minsk), Hamburger, Berliner etc.

May 27 2008, 8:08 PM
free email trivia FREE! Get a new mixed Fun Trivia quiz each day in your email. It's a fun way to start your day!


arrow Your Email Address:

Sign in or Create Free User ID to participate in the discussion

Related FunTrivia Quizzes

play quiz Surnames Ending in ER
( People by Surname)
play quiz Surnames ending in -SON
( Same Surname)
play quiz Surnames ending in -ING
(Name Game)

Return to FunTrivia
"Ask FunTrivia" strives to offer the best answers possible to trivia questions. We ask our submitters to thoroughly research questions and provide sources where possible. Feel free to post corrections or additions. This is server B184.